Episode 79: Getting To The Root Of Health Issues With The Founders Of Zesty Ginger
Episode 79: Getting To The Root Of Health Issues With The Founders Of Zesty Ginger
In this episode we sit down with....Dr. Alex and Megan of Zesty Ginger.
Dr. Alex Golden (M.D.) and Megan Blacksmith (Health Coach & Functional Diagnostic Nutrition Practitioner and graduate of Chris Kresser’s ADAPT Practitioner training) of Zesty Ginger help women optimize brain function and hormone health by teaching women to use the power of their thoughts and beliefs as well as the phases of their menstrual cycles to their advantage. The natural ebb and flow that happens to our hormones, organ systems, and bodies overall as women is there to renew and strengthen us. When we work with the natural cycles of our bodies, we allow ourselves to heal and recover on a level that few of us ever reach when we operate within the “rules” of the hectic modern world. They are the founders of Healthy Hormones group program, Health Transformation Accelerator, Flight or Flight Fix as well as co-host of the 4 Phase Cycle Podcast.
In this conversation we talk about:
Advice when your labs continue to come up inconclusive
Addressing beliefs and habitual ways of thinking
Their definition of limiting decisions and how to reframe your beliefs
The why behind low libido in women
What cycle syncing is and why is it so important
Their favorite stress reduction techniques
Connect with our guest...
Resources we mention in this episode…
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TRANSCRIPTIONEpisode 79: Getting To The Root Of Health Issues With The Founders Of Zesty Ginger
Katelyn:
Okay, we have Dr. Alex and Megan Blacksmith on the show today. Hi, ladies. Welcome. Thank you so much for being here today.
Dr. Alex + Megan:
Thanks so much for having us. Hi. Happy to be here.
Katelyn:
Yeah, I'm really looking forward to everything that we are about to get into. And also makes me just so happy that you two are together since you're not together normally. And you're in the same room right now. So this feels really cozy and safe and supportive.
Dr. Alex + Megan:
Absolutely. Yeah, we are, even though we met on Instagram. And we have never lived in the same place. So we have definitely figured out a way to make sure we travel to one another regularly to get our Meghan and Alex time.
Katelyn:
Love and I can't wait to hear how the both of you met. So let's just dive into this conversation. And I can't wait to hear each of your own body image stories. So Dr. Alex, let's start with you. If you are cool with that. Let’s talk about your first body awareness moment. This is the question that we ask everybody on the show. What did that moment look like for you- that moment where you realized, I'm in a body, this means something in the world that I'm living in, just paint the picture for us that moment in particular, and also how that shaped your relationship with your body and or food moving forward.
Dr. Alex (body image story):
Absolutely. So for me, this was something that definitely unfolded over time. Because when I was a kid, I had some sort of traumatic body experiences. And while mentally I was a pretty happy go lucky kid and super optimistic. I do think that was the basis of some disconnection that I had from my body. That was set up pretty early. That being said, I did not feel or emotionally attached to those things until I hit puberty. So I was one of those ladies that hit puberty pretty early compared, you know, in comparison to the average not we're not talking about like earlier because of what's going on in society, which is like pretty early on in the spectrum of things for people. And I also grew into my body very quickly. And so by the time I was 11, I was the height that I am now, I'm 5’9. And I went from being a scrawny little kid, like super knobby kneed, and just always looked like I was totally underfed, which is not true because I'm Russian and my mom will force feed us till the cows come home. But I essentially went from that very, very rapidly, essentially over the course of a summer. And I was by far the tallest and biggest kid in my class. I had a really good friend Anna at the time, who was also like this, it was just probably why we gravitated towards each other. So people would call us the Twin Towers, because we were like ahead and a half taller than everyone else. And because of that I essentially filled out and became very curvy in that same period of time. And that was when I started noticing that people started to have comments on my body in a way that had never happened before. So things started happening, like boys at school would say, like, Oh, I can see that you're wearing a bra, or something like that. And then I used to play a lot of piano, I was a piano major before I went to medical school. And I would do performances. And there would be people that would comment, like, on the length of the dresser that my mom had chosen for me because I was still, you know, 11 or 12. And, but I look like I was 1415, probably. And so there'd be other adults that would point things out where I was in ballet, and all of a sudden, it was like, well, you're not so thin anymore. But ballerinas are thin. So you know that that's something to look out for. And so it was a conversation that was essentially never set up. For me in terms of context, it was just these one off comments. And because of them, the body transition happened very rapidly. And therefore their response to me changed very rapidly, then all of a sudden, I started feeling like other people are assessing my body. And I started standing in front of the mirror for the first time in my life, and really like dissecting what I look like. So I got really self-conscious about my thighs being curry, you know, they had never looked like that before. And so, I started really just noticing things like cellulite. And that was essentially my first entry to starting to compare myself to other people. For better or for worse, there was no social media at that time. So, it was mostly magazines and things like that. But I began to compare myself to those women and what I look like. And essentially that started, you know, my path disordered eating. But it was like “Well, people are really judging me for what I look like, and therefore I need to have control over that”. And what is probably a very, very common story, right? It's just the evolution of what it looks like to really monitor your movement, your food, and all of that stuff, which we have now very much gotten away from and is the opposite of our focus. But it was because of this entire setup that I essentially went down that road.
Katelyn:
Yeah, I think it's really interesting that you mentioned control, when I can so clearly hear in your story, this feeling of being out of control based on how everybody else is giving you feedback about your body. And yeah, like this feeling of just personal security and what's yours, and also what you're describing in terms of the self-objectification that's coming up- how you're choosing to uphold your body to a standard based on the standards that everybody else is telling you that it should be. So what's the next step in or the next chapter in your story Dr. Alex?
Dr. Alex:
Yeah, so the next chapter got a little dicey. But it has a good ending. So, I'll spoil that to begin with. Essentially, I started going through the different stages of the dieting mentality. And at first, I embraced calories in calories out, which is very, very interesting, because, you know, essentially, this was decades ago now. And when we are on social media, we are still making posts and videos explaining how calories in and calories now out is not the holy grail and the ultimate determinant. And we still have people fighting us on it. We recently had a male trainer that was like, “No, really, I've been telling people that it's calories in and calories out for decades. And it's really annoying to me that you're trying to change people's minds.” Right. So, this is decades later and we're still having the same conversation, which from a medical standpoint, is really incredibly outdated. So, you know I wouldn't say we've resolved that, but I think we've come a long way. So essentially, I started counting calories, although, you know, my parents didn't support that kind of notion. So, I can't say I did it well, but I had the general concept of, if I skip certain meals, then I can have goldfish, which is what I really like. And I can do like the mega size version of it. And, I can snack on that instead. So, I started doing things like that. And then over time, especially kind of as I got closer to college, that's when I found that, you know, food alone wasn't, it would change my weight, but not my composition. So then being like, Hmm, well, what needs to happen, then, I found exercise. So, then I started exercising a whole bunch, Megan and I have both run marathons and things like that. And so I started doing calorie restriction and exercise. And I would do things like, run 20 miles, and I would count like, you know, a certain number of calories per mile. And then that would add up to like, I could eat a pint of Ben and Jerry's, because that's what I could have. And so, that was the kind of thing I was doing, or I would round up my piece of gum to the next 100 calories. That kind of stuff. Overall, though, it's very interesting in that it was so accepted that at the moment, I actually didn't think I had a problem. That's how kind of under wraps it was. No one ever came up to me and said, “Hey, you know, are you okay? Is this like something fine?” Everyone was like, “it's so great that you run so much”. And oh, like, “You're at a low, you know, low or healthy weight” or whatever, right? Even though my weight would really fluctuate, but, from the outside, everyone was like, “it looks like you're doing okay, right? Looks like you're doing all the right stuff.” And so I just never, it was what I was doing to cope and to feel okay about myself. And it wasn't, it was only after, essentially, I had a health crash. So, I had been having lots of pelvic pain as a teenager. And as I got into adulthood, and started having generalized chronic pain, which is why I'm an interventional pain doctor right now. However, what happened was that I kept going to different doctors, I probably went to like 15 to 20 doctors over the course of the years being like, I'm in pain, my periods are awful, all of this stuff. And I was told you're fine, you're totally good. It was, I think a lot of women can relate because as young females, a lot of times, we're kind of just told that you're fine, like you're too young and healthy to have a problem. And that's essentially what was happening. And then in my 20s, I got married, was trying to have kids. And then at 27, I finally went and said, like, you know, I'm not getting pregnant, I've had all this stuff, something is wrong. And then they did a bunch of tests. And they said, which didn't end up being true, but they said, oh my gosh, you're going into menopause, you have six months to try to do IVF and have kids and then that'll be it for you. And it was such a powerful shake up. At that point. I had started getting into health just because of the pain stuff and but really, that was the time when it was such a complete overhaul to what I thought my life would look like. And for the whole time I've kind of been going along and like maybe I am crazy. Like I you know, I don't feel good, but they can't ever find anything and stuff like that. And when that happened, I essentially burned down everything when it came to health and then it started a complete overhaul of my life, which I think is honestly still playing out as it tends to but what happened then was, I really had to evaluate like, what was I going to do for my health? How was I going to interact with my body? Because I kept saying I wanted to feel better, and I didn't want to have pain anymore. But I still had such a contentious relationship with my body from all the years of that kind of stuff, and this is a longer story. But essentially, when I closed my eyes to visualize my body, then my brain wouldn't even recognize it, it wouldn't even construct a visual representation of my body, I could see my head and part of my torso, and it was completely black. And then it was my lower legs and feet, like my brain had just stopped. Even registering that kind of thing. And so, because of that, it was a complete overhaul. I mean, I had a real look at what I had going on and saying, what does it look like to heal from the inside out and have that impact every single facet of how I felt and interacted with my own body. And that launched the best phase that I've had so far, which is just complete, no learning to accept myself, free eating free, you know, we essentially do all of the anti-diet culture in our business here and what we teach, because of these things, essentially, our story is so common that we use that as, as our example and as our way of talking about how to overcome that. So, it has turned out very, very well. I'm so lucky that I have those kinds of experiences that I can talk about, and then back it up with actual, the most current science of what we know about how the female body works, and all of the things that go into it. But it wasn't, it wasn't easy getting here, but I am grateful for all of it happening the way it did.
Katelyn:
Wow. What a powerful story. I have so many questions, I want to ask a few before we pivot to Megan's story. And first of all, thank you so much for your vulnerability and sharing all of this and everything that you're saying. I'm just nodding my head. And I know so many people are going to listen to this and think, oh my god, I get it. I get it. So, first of all, a couple of things are coming up- what you described would you have diagnosed yourself with an eating disorder back then knowing what you know now, as a doctor?
Dr. Alex:
I definitely say disordered eating. I don't know. You know, Megan's story is a little bit more classical in terms of diagnosis. But absolutely, I would not have said I was, I think orthorexia is probably the category I fit into, because it was all control over what I was allowing myself to do or not, but it but it even extended into once I the reason I say around the IVF time is because I had actually gotten into more holistic health before then. The thing that I now know in retrospect, though, was that I was even doing that with healthy foods. So, I started eating, but it was like, and this happened, we work with women all the time that are like I'm trying to get healthy. I'm listening to all the experts tell me what I need to be doing for my body, which is like doing elimination diets. And this is what elimination diets look like, and this is good food. And this is bad for you. And this is probiotics, but not if you have SIBO, you know, like there's just 1,000,010 things. And I was still using all of those control mechanisms to then apply to the healthier food that I was having. So, for me, like I stepped through kind of the Paleo template. And granted, a lot of it was actually useful. I had SIBO I, you know, had endometriosis. That was actually, you know, not being controlled. Celiac disease. There were a lot of things that I didn't need help with when it came to my health. But it was done in such a way that I was so obsessive about the food. And I would label it so much like I was judged. This is good. This is bad. Oh no, I have this. And that was told to me like don't do that kind of thing. And so, I was still actually in that mindset, but the food from the outside was just on a different plane. Like I wasn't doing the Ben and Jerry's anymore, but it was like if I didn't have something paleo Yeah. And I know I beat myself up. You hit the nail on the head, it sounds like too, I mean, for so many of us. And it sounds like you're acknowledging this for yourself as well, too. It's just this really consistent message of control and needing control. And that is why we actually do in our programs, we actually focus on listening to your own body's signals and cues.
Throughout the experience, because we've really made it all about external cues on what your body should be doing. And really the whole answer to having a lot of information out there, it's nice that we are all able to share information, it's nice that you can find people that you jive with that, you know, works for one person and doesn't work for someone else. We're grateful for that. However, the flip side of that is, if it's all being told to you, it's like, all of us are different if you wake up on any given day, something's gonna work for you one day and not the next. And then the third day could work again, right? It's so interactive, and so fluid, that unless the focus turns back around to how I feel, what is it that I need? And what is my internal sense? like? What does it look like to listen to your own intuition around things? That's what we ended up going back to, because there's no way someone could give every single person a template, we develop our own template through trial and error. So that's actually the journey, right? How do you listen to your own body, and through the practice of it, garner the information that builds out the toolkit that you then continue to use and have worked for you for the rest of your life, that changes the conversation completely, because then you're never again, at the mercy of what was told, there's a lot of things that I hear now that I can assimilate, and I can appreciate, and I can integrate into my bigger understanding of health. But I no longer feel like I need to carry it out. Right. I'm like, that's just not applicable to me. And I'm grateful that I can still understand it. Whereas before, because the focus was outside, it always felt threatening, like, why I'm not doing that, what's wrong with me? Right? It's like, that's the conversation you have, and it's completely different than. And so that's where our goal is. And we have people coming in that work with us all the time that its really just practice saying, how do I listen to myself? And how do I not make myself wrong? For having those feedback moments, you sometimes have to overstep so that you know, then, hey, that didn't feel good in this context. Now, next time? No, we talked about the context of the cycle, for example, right? Some things, when you're having your period, you feel a certain way, when you're around the week of your ovulation, you could feel totally different, the same input could happen and cause a different result. So that's the kind of feedback that you kind of have to go through and be okay with it. But that gets at this crux of self-love and self-acceptance, because overstepping can either be, hey, look, I got feedback, or overstepping can be, I always mess this up. And I'll never be better. And it's the exact same thing that happened. So, it was just very, very important to ask, like, what am I focusing on? Because the steps could look exactly the same, but the outcome would be very different.
Katelyn:
Well, I am so with you. And I also think that there are so many people who are going to listen to your story and think I am going through this, there is something that is happening with my body that I am trying to get answers for, and I keep feeling invalidated. Because the tests keep coming up blank. And my doctor keeps telling me I'm fine. And I know deep down that something is really wrong. And I really heard that in your story. And how frustrating that that probably was for you.
Dr. Alex:
So true, and it's so common that like we joke around that are for Zesty Ginger or like a family needs to say like, sorry, your labs are normal. Like, I mean, we're totally tongue in cheek about that. But that is when we say that there's a whole like MIT, we've had millions of people see, you know, like in our tic toc channel and things like that. Where they get in there like oh my gosh, me too. Yeah. So, across the board, it's not even funny, which is my main and I always like If we're not in competition with anyone else out there, because there's so many women to help, there's like, it's a joke to think that there could be fewer voices sharing helpful things.
Katelyn:
Well, let's stay with your story for a moment before we zoom the lens out of it. But first of all, why do you feel like this was happening to you? Why do you feel like the lab, the labs kept coming up inconclusive? When you were trying to figure out what was happening? And how did you get to a point where you were able to make sense of what was really going on with your body and kind of put a name to it?
Dr. Alex:
Definitely, I, first of all, I think we do continue to make improvements in medicine, so I think that we are headed overall in the right direction, though, we're still obviously behind where we would all want. That being said, it really, I think our understanding of what's happening is improving overall, however, I do think our deal with the labs is that a lot of people are looking for one thing to solve their problem. And one thing to kind of hone in on. And it's a very closed off look like let me use the example of PCs, you know, people are like, I got a diagnosis of PCs, because I had acne and regular cycle. So then, generally speaking, people will do labs, and they'd be like, well, your overall estrogen is fine. And then your testosterone is high, like let's do birth control. But birth control can be a very helpful tool. But again, when you contrast that to the work that we do, which really goes back to the chain, and there's a lot of people that are trying to do this now, but essentially asking, why did out of everything we know about the hormonal system, which starts at the very top of the chain at the brain level, what did the brain chemistry tell the rest of the body to do? And then from the brain, it goes, you know, the portion called the hypothalamus. And the hypothalamus is the general that makes the decision of what our hormones look like. That's the one that's going to lead the charge of how the hypothalamus is telling the hormone producing organs, like the ovaries, what to do, which is going to set up the no cysts on the ovaries that people are looking at. Right? So, you can actually go way further back. And what we like to do is ask, why did that get set up in the first place? Rather than just saying once the symptoms are there? How do I squash them rather than looking at? Why did that happen? Because if the root cause can be changed, all of the downstream manifestations of it, go along with it, right? Because we like to pretend like, well, it's the acne, if we just fix the acne, or whatever, if we fix the regularity, that'll be that. But the truth of the matter is, when things are looped in like that, there's always other downstream manifestations, you know, the brain is also going to be talking to the adrenals, which is going to be cortisol. So, our weight regulation, our energy, the way that we sleep, our creativity, our productivity, these aren't just things like I get through my life. This is how we optimize things, not only to resolve problems, but to actually thrive in our life. That's the conversation I think everyone wants to be having, because what we actually want to do is thrive. It's not like that, I'm gonna keep my life the same. It just don't want acne and like, of course, you know, sometimes that's a kind of think of first, but as a general rule, if you ask them, like, what is it that you really want, they're like, I just want to be like happy living my life feeling really good in it. The one thing is that that's a really long kind of answer to your question, but essentially, if you're not looking at the right things, you're not going to find the right answers. So a lot of times people are looking at labs that look at end organ damage, you know, you get a regular cam panel, and it's like do you have is you're creating and going up, do you have kidney damage, but if you look at when I was 18, having pelvic pain, it that's kind of stuff is never going to show up because my kidneys are hanging out in there, like there's until they're really having a problem is not going to show up on those labs. So, you can get a bunch of what are called labs, but not every lab is the right lab for you to find what you're looking for. You're just digging in the wrong place.
Katelyn:
Well, how do you know if somebody is listening to this, and thinking Okay, so I won't get labs anymore. What do I do now? What, what direction do they go?
Dr. Alex:
And we love labs, but we do functional lab work. So, they're playing that. Yeah, what is so functional lab work is a little more comprehensive. So, for example, you can get. And there's actually nothing wrong with lab work as long as it's being used in the right way and making the right interpretation. Because here's, I think what you're really getting at is, if you have issues going on, and the lab work doesn't explain it, you're not done. And so, you can get lab work that says, that's fine, you've essentially ruled out that that's not the problem. But that doesn't mean that then it's all in your head. What it means is that you haven't found it yet. So, you need to dig deeper. So that can be bloodwork or labs that are done through a doctor, again, it's just a matter of what is the problem? And are you done digging for it? Generally speaking, though, things like the dried urine test for comprehensive hormones, but it's called DUTCH because that's the acronym essentially, is looking at urine metabolites. So instead of just getting like a blood level of estrogen and progesterone, which is helpful, and we use those two, but the metabolites, they start, you know, what is the hypothalamus setup from the hormone producing organs? And then once the hormones were made, how did you break them down, because the way you broke them down, goes back to tell the brain what to do. So, you're always in this circular loop, right. And so essentially, the more specific information that you get, and that's why a lot of times people are actually searching for providers who identify as functional providers, that's kind of the buzzword currently, sometimes people use integrative or holistic practitioners, like Megan is a Functional Diagnostic nutrition practitioner. And so those are people who have self-identified, I am looking for the root cause. So, if someone's like, well, this is a completely novel concept. To me, that's essentially what I'd look for. But the lab labs are good, we like labs, but labs have to coincide with the story, or you were just not done looking.
Katelyn:
Mm hmm. So, in your case, what, what did you end up discovering about the big mystery with the pain that you were experiencing? And just the discomfort in your own body? Were you ever able to make sense of what was really going on that you were being invalidated with all those years?
Dr. Alex:
Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, it took 17 years, but out of all the things I've done, I'm probably the most proud of that. And so essentially, yes, I got diagnosed with endometriosis, had multiple surgeries, did IVF, that kind of thing. However, it really went back down to what was happening at the level of my central nervous system. And that's a lot of what we teach about because, yes, the hormones matter and the symptoms that you ultimately get matter. But the common denominator for all of it is the central nervous signaling. And so, for that, it was really looking at my neurotransmitter levels, like what were what was my brain chemistry doing, making sure that my brain felt safe, a lot of what I was doing in terms of calorie restrictions over exercising, it's evolutionary kind of consequence of the brain is not going to set you up for healthy pregnancy. A lot of times, if it doesn't feel like it's safe, maybe they just don't make a whole lot of sense for if there's a famine or something going on, now's not the time to be on the hook for making a whole new person. And so, a lot of what I was doing was actually in direct competition to the goal that I decided I wanted, so I wanted to be healthy. And I wanted to be able to thrive and do the optional things. You know, like, how babies have really good energy. how, you know, like, all of the thriving things, you don't need them for survival, unfortunately. And so, as it wasn't just only the food in the labs, I really had to go down to like, how did I think about myself? How did I allow myself rest? What were the beliefs? I mean, I used to walk past the mirror and be like, gosh, like, I hate you so much. Right? And it's like, I could have the best diet and the healthiest, like, I could do all the supplements and all the protocols based on my lab work. But that's essentially if that's always playing the central nervous system. It's just sitting there listening. From the way that it works, it's taking everything into account. So, whether a bag of Doritos or I repeatedly think that I'm ugly, it's just like, okay, there's no difference to it in terms of just kind of like junk food or junk thoughts. And so, all of it had to be revamped. So essentially, yes, I did the lab work, I did the protocols, there was years of really revamping the way I interacted with my body and like, repeating my nutrients, right, I had kind of starved and worked out myself and to kind of a hole in terms of my body's physiology. And that impacts the, you know, down to the very kind of granular areas like mitochondrial dysfunction, which is a whole other thing we could nerd out about. However, all of that did need to happen. But it needed to be paired with a much bigger look of like, what was the reason that I was doing the things and I was making the choices that really led to those outcomes? And the reason my brain was doing what it was doing. And then there was a lot of kind of belief for lying, Megan's and NLP Ninja, so she was able to help me out. I did all sorts of things like hypnosis and meditation and visualizations, and I just really had to even have my body and my brain recognize like you have a pelvis, let's stop ignoring it. Right, like, there was just a lot of work that had to go into it. But altogether, it ended, I ended up rewiring the central nervous system enough that I no longer have chronic pain. And so that was really cool. And it really reminds us all that story is our constant kind of reminder that the brain is never static. So, you're never stuck at where you are. You can always say the if, if we're thinking something, and it's a habit because we've hardwired our neurons together to keep thinking that. And we can change that by focusing on other things. And heart when we do that, we're actually hardwiring the neurons to think and fire in a different way. And the more we reinforce that idea, the stronger that connection gets. So, it goes from like a footpath to a superhighway. And so that we have the ultimate control, like that is like the control that we want to do through food and stuff. That's like, nothing, right? It doesn't look like you were pointing out that it doesn't actually do anything. But the ultimate control is saying, regardless of what's happening in my life, I will focus on what I want, instead of the absence of what I want. And with that actually has the power to change our physiology, it basically means you can have whatever it is that you want, as long as you're willing to do it. As long as you're willing to put in the work.
Katelyn:
I think that is so powerful. just focusing on what you want versus the absence of what you don't have. Is that what you’re saying?
Dr. Alex:
Exactly. Yeah. Right. So it's hard to imagine not having pain, when you've had evidence of 17 years of pain, like I totally get that I didn't understand at first either. Because I think when you first hear what you're like, what do you mean? Like how I am supposed to not pay attention, but it was baby steps. And it was practice, and it was all this stuff. But it does really illustrate that no matter how bad reality seems, it's always changeable because your physiology is actually on your side. I'm more than happy to rewire in something else. It has no opinion of that on its own.
Katelyn:
Mm hmm. So before we move before we move forward to Megan, if somebody is really resonating with your story and everything that you're sharing right now, Dr. Alex, what's the next step that you would really encourage somebody to take on their own journey of just feeling defeated and wanting to possibly begin their own path of rewiring beliefs or taking care of themselves in a new radical way are getting answers? What's something that stands out in your own journey that was probably one of the most significant pieces of the puzzle for you?
Dr. Alex
Addressing beliefs and habitual ways of thinking I think is probably the end that will get you everywhere else. Because once you look at what your brain is assuming is true. Then, then you can start to actually question those things. And then you can make conscious decisions around. So that is the end. But there are, there's actually a lot of ways to get at it. So just like there's no one way of eating, and there's no one way of healing, essentially,there's many different ways to get at it. And then, we have all those in our pocket. So, if someone's like, really just new to this, starting at season one of our pot is called four phase cycle podcasts. But essentially, you'll hear a lot more of the details of our stories of how we got there. And then that'll launch into actually actionable stuff. So, we have ways of knowing what's happening, you know, based on your symptoms and your cycle, you're going to see, start seeing the bigger picture, there's so many things you can learn about your bodies. When you know what to look for, I think that's probably the thing that we've been missing the most is that we don't, we don't get taught about how our bodies work. So, we don't know how to interpret it. So, you're always trying to listen to someone else. So essentially, our podcast is all about flipping that script of how you understand what is happening, and then taking action from it. That's how you build the evidence for yourself that you can, you can feel better, are healthy hormones group programs, that by the time this airs, it's gonna be close to opening our doors. This is where we do lab testing. So, we do neurotransmitter testing, like the brain chemistry, we get the DUTCH we look at the entire chain of the hormonal system. And from that we actually teach people how to interpret their own labs. Because really, our whole deal is we are trying to take ourselves out of the equation, how do we teach people so much that they just develop their own toolkit and don't need someone, there's so many women to help that. Our goal is to really like to get people super caught up, teach them how to do it for themselves, and then cut them loose. And people can go, they have the babies, or they go through, you know, there's they start perimenopause, things change. But if you have an understanding of how things change and what's actually happening underneath the hood, then most people don't have a problem with the fact that things are changing. What they have a problem with is they don't know what to do when that happens. And so that's essentially our healthy hormones group program. And it's all about connecting back to yourself. Plus having the data from the labs to actually figure out what's going on. The two together are super-duper magical. And then of course, adding things like hypnosis and, and even ways of practicing intuition is something that we heavily focus on. Because there's just so many facets of life that get started to get looped in here that it becomes, rather than being like, let me figure out my health. And then oh, by the way, there's the rest of my life. It all just kind of cohesively comes together as like this is who I am, and who I am permeates everything that I do.
Katelyn:
Yep, oh my god, I love it. We'll link everything that you just talked about as well, too. But this is who I am. This is something I personally speak to clients a lot about. And there's so much identity disruption that normally occurs in the process as well, too. And one thing that I think is so fascinating based on everything that you're sharing, as well, I was just taking a moment to just sit with some things that might come up in this conversation before we hit record. And I was thinking about the concept of stress and our brain and how that impacts our bodies and also the belief around why we are in dueling mode all the time that creates all this stress and dismantling that belief. And also, who are we without the belief that we need to be busy all the time or need to be performing a certain way or showing up a certain way just so much dismantling. And that's scary, you know that's like the epitome of change. And I think that's also why so many people resist doing this work sometimes too, because it does really it is confronting in terms of how we need to change in order to heal, but it's absolutely necessary and it sounds like what you have in your, in your practice is a really safe environment for people to do this work.
Dr. Alex:
Katelyn, that's a big piece that you just brought up on you’re like mind reading over here. But that's a big part of Megan's story, is things like that. And, and that's why we're so open about sharing our stories for that reason is because most people when we talk, they're like, Oh my gosh, me too. Like, the board.
Katelyn:
Yeah. I mean, this is like the Me Too! podcast. Okay, Megan, let's pivot to you. Thanks for being patient. And, Dr. Alex, thank you for sharing your story. We might have to have part two of this episode, but we'll see how far we get because I have so many things that I want to ask you collectively. But Hi, Megan.
Megan:
Hey, there. Hi.
Katelyn:
Dr. Alex has such a good story. I am just so inspired and appreciative. Let's hear yours, though. So, let's start with your first body awareness moment. And what did that look like for you? How did that shape your relationship with your body and or food moving forward?
Megan (body image story):
Absolutely. So, my role in our Zesty Ginger duo business here is that I really focus on the mindset piece and the beliefs. So that part you're just hitting up on it's definitely my jam, and where I really love to focus. So, when you brought up this question, I immediately started to think Okay, where did these beliefs come from, and I think it was a matter of body awareness, it was a matter of like, slowly kind of pulling these beliefs. As you know, life happens. And as time goes by it goes, I remember a really early memory of my brother, my older brother is like seven years older, we had this game where I would sneak up on him. And every time he would spot me, he would yell “fat!”. So, I didn't really think much of it at the time. And now you know, looking back at this kind of the programming, right, so there's this, there's this piece of like, okay, that wasn't good. So that that was one part of the piece. And then later on, you know, pulling in playing sports, I can remember playing sports in middle school and actually feeling like my body wasn't developing, it was the opposite of Dr. Alex, like it wasn't developing. And I remember seeing Oh, the older girls are, like shaving their legs and hiding, because my mom told me I couldn't and like finding a razor and starting to try to change my physical appearance, wanting to be different, look different, to be like these other girls. And then I feel like I kept pulling in more beliefs.
Overall, at the time, they were very positive beliefs, right? So, they were the beliefs of if I work really hard or if I get all A's, I will get a lot of, you know, acceptance and love from my family, people really like that. If I am captain, captain of the team, I get a lot of feedback for that. So, like, the more you did, right? Like, the more the better you were at things, the more I brought in, then the more I seem to get accolades for that. So, I started to really tie that belief in. And this is something that we see overall, constantly with women we work with, right, there's this you need to do a certain amount, prove yourself to feel worthy to feel loved. So, there's this constant like, go, I have to do it over and over. And you can see why some of this belief really did help you early on like this could really help you, for example, grow a business, this could really help you get all A's, this can really help you get through. I went to school to be an engineer, right? Early on, this really, really served me. And then I started to see that belief was pretty strong. And then when you start to take that belief, and you shift it to your body, something else happens because there's this whole Okay, well, all you have to do is control the environment, work hard, do the things and then you should get what you want. Because that was always the formula. And then all of a sudden, you're trying to do something. So, in college, I decided I started to see my body shift, right? Like, I was drinking more alcohol. I wasn't I wasn't really sleeping; I was doing things that really started to creep up, creep up on me and I saw my body started to shift and the whole like, Okay, this is the formula that you follow you eat less you workout more you do these things, didn't do anything. And then that's kind of a head scratcher. Because all of this belief of working harder and it works out had been true. So, I think that kind of starts to make you question like, Oh, no, like, what happened to my paradigm? And am I just not good enough? That's not why it's not working out. And so, at that point, I had decided I had started to throw up after eating and I became bulimic. And I remember it was to the point that I really didn't want to be doing it. Like, intellectually. I was like, this is so bad for me. I know this is not good for my body. I know I'm ruining my teeth, I actually remember going to the library and reading about how bad it was for me trying to snap myself out of it. And at the same time, it felt like the only way, the only way that I'm doing air quotes that worked, right, so this was the only way that my body would shift to the place that I wanted it to be. And then I was also getting positive feedback about my physical appearance when I knew inside how horrible I was being to myself, so I'm hearing externally, oh, you look great now, like, what do you know what's going on. And then internally, I'm like, I feel like a disaster. And this is a horrible place to be. And this is not great for me. But there was a mismatch. So, pulling all the messages together. I see often with the women we work with, it's like, the messages and the beliefs early on that helped them become that successful. They were Type A like they made stuff happen. And they've made businesses happen, they've made life happen, they have families, and now it's caught up with them in a way that doesn't apply very well to their health and their food. And this is how we're helping them reframe. reframe that original belief and reframe that more and harder, and restriction actually takes a lot longer to get you to where you want to go.
Katelyn:
So how did you get to that place for yourself where you realize that something needed to change?
Megan:
So, I think that I had a kind of an awakening, when after I had my first child, I like to say I fell off the hormone cliff. So, I then started to experience a lot of postpartum concern, issues and severe anxiety, and panic attacks. And so, I had to hit a really big low for me to then say, Okay, how about all of these things I'm doing to get my body to externally be a certain way, they are now fully adding up and taking a toll. And I had the same experience as Dr. Alex in all my lab work set up good to go. No, you're totally fine. And not feeling that way. So Oh, it was to the point that I was so extremely fatigued that I really did consider how I could get out of work- I had a corporate job back then. And I was like, I could just break my arm. If I just broke my arm, I wouldn't have to go in; I just wanted out of everything. So that's how extreme it was. But in the lab work everything said I was fine. So luckily, at that point, I found an amazing holistic nutritionist, and I found the lab work, the functional lab work that we now use, I found that I did have imbalances in my hormone levels, I did have balances in my brain chemistry, I had a gut infection, like I found there were actual physical things going on. That helped me say, okay, not all in my head. And at the same time started to learn how much of it was in my head and how much the signal from my head going down to my body was like Dr. Alex, you're not safe. You're not good enough, you need to do more. And I was sending that constant stress also, then I started to realize, Oh, the power of my thoughts, the power of my food, the impact of what I'm putting on my body in my body. And that just opened the whole like, you know, holistic. Everything from there, it was the end to finally see, okay, there is something that I can do, and I can feel better. And as I felt better, I was just like, Oh, I, I can't believe this is a job. I want to help everybody. I want everybody to know that. You don't have to just sit around and feel horrible because someone told you your lab work is fine.
Katelyn:
Mm hmm. What were some of the shifts that stand out to you that you made that really made a difference and helped you start to feel better for yourself?
Megan:
Yeah, early on, I'd say I was still a little bit following an old eating model where I wasn't aware of that, you know, good quality, like salt and lots of great fats and how important it was for my adrenal health. So, starting to just be aware of the foods I was eating, getting, actually adding in plenty of complex carbohydrates, we see that a lot. And that's a category I fell into. A lot of people are being told, like, you know, carbs make you fat, or whatever this belief is. And for your hormone levels, they're incredibly important. So actually, adding in more foods, adding in more good quality foods. Being aware of, you know, quality, for sure. I wasn't really much aware of how the quality was upgrading things like, you know, water, making sure I'm filtering it, but really for me, then the reason why my main focus now is the mindset and the beliefs. It was digging into what was
We call them instead of limiting beliefs, limiting decisions. So, at some point, you decided to believe this right? So, digging out what are these limiting decisions you've made along the line. And sometimes they can look like things that you would never really know are there, but there's a huge secondary gain. So, I started to realize, like, oh, anytime I was sick, I actually got a lot of love and attention and help. And even as an adult, like, when I was sick, like my husband's, I'll take care of the kids. My mom's like, Yeah, I got you. So, there was this tie between not feeling well and getting more help getting more love. And never in a million years would say, Oh, I'm just making myself feel horrible. So, I can get someone to make me dinner. Right? It wasn't conscious. And it was there. And it was tied. And it was, it was pretty strong, because I felt I could only ask for help. If I felt that, that would be bad. And so, rewiring that belief and saying, actually, I can help, I'm worthy of help all the time. And how about I don't play the martyr and don't put everything on me all the time, because it becomes an all or nothing, right? When you're feeling good, you do everything, you're like, I will do everything. I'm the mom and everything. And then to the point that I would crash myself out and feel horrible and be able to do nothing. So being able to accept help earlier on and being aware that this was a pattern and a belief, and just starting to really break down any of those beliefs that are getting in the way of you feeling amazing every day. I see this one a lot as well, too. And I've I bump up against this as well and have done a lot of work in rewiring the belief around asking for help and just the identity around being able to do it all myself personally.
Katelyn:
So, for you and rewiring this specific belief, what was the biggest fear or resistance in beginning to do this work around this belief of the I can do it all mentality and the vulnerability around asking for help? Or having harder conversations more vulnerably?
Megan:
Yeah, well, it can start to feel like you're taking away your identity, you know, I've been good at things. I got all A's, like I was captain of the team. So, this becomes the thing you know, you do well, and the thing that you're in control of or feel in control of which is totally an illusion. But it feels that way. So, once you start to write, say, oh, okay, I actually would love to help and do need help and can ask for it. At first, it did really feel uncomfortable. I felt like oh, I'm failing. I had that belief that I'm failing, if I have to, I'm failing, I'm weak, I shouldn't need help, I should do this. And I would only be if I could justify it. My husband never really understood this poor guy, he, I would make a list of like things I've done and things he did then in my head, of course, but you know, if I felt like it had tipped over into like, I had done all this stuff, then I could get help from him. And he just didn't have that same kind of list in his head. So, I didn't really understand, right? If he needed help you would ask for help. And when I needed help, I had to make sure I had earned it.
Katelyn:
So, what you've already articulated is the new belief for yourself, and I am worthy of help and support. But beyond the mantra there, what's the emotion that you have really allowed yourself to sit with this new belief? How, how is this belief safe for you to really just move forward with your life?
Megan:
I'd say this belief was actually really tied to anger, anger and resentment. So, one of the things I work with clients with is clearing, limiting decisions and negative emotions from your timeline. So, from your earlier situations in your life, there can be something early on, that was a really powerful, strong emotion, situation, and then we've tied that emotion to it forever, within your memory, so then anytime it comes up, I can kind of pull up that memory. And for me, this was more about different situations in my life that had led to resentment that I really need to work through and journal through and understand why that feeling was tied to this belief because it was more it was it was more of a feeling that I was afraid of letting go of or as if I if I let it go then therefore it made something okay, that had happened to me in the past and starting to realize No, I can actually forgive and let go and still recognize certain things were not okay. So I think really working through each individual event and things that were tied to those emotions and those beliefs has helped just it's totally, it's totally clear now. And I actually go the other way of asking for tons of help and be really like, yeah, I am going to take a nap right now. watch me, watch me go take a nap right now in the middle of the day. So, it's really fun now.
Katelyn
So cool. I love everything that you just described. And yeah, like, even just hearing where you are right now in your life. And the joy that's really coming through in your story. And I really got it like this work is really like I said, it's really confronting, there's a reason why we resist doing it. There's a reason why we bury these memories and these timeline events way down, because it does require us to process emotionally and that's uncomfortable as well as bumping up against identities and beliefs and all these things. But damn it is such powerful work, to get yourself to a place where you can live authentically and joyfully. And you can really thrive like the both of you are saying in each of your stories as well too. And just leading by example is so important. The work that you're doing is so important. And I'm just so grateful that you've created this space for people to heal on this. Okay, I want to take this a different direction. If it's cool with the both of you, I want to just jam on some rapid-fire questions with things that are coming to my mind because you have a podcast that probably has an episode for every single thing that I'm going to ask you. But I'd love to quickly take on some of the things that are coming up that are really common in this community that I hear a lot and your expertise on why this happens. How we can debunk this and also reframe. Reframe a belief or a tool for some of these things. Does that sound okay?
Dr Alex + Megan:
Absolutely.
Katelyn:
Okay, sweet. So, let's start with libido. Why do so many women have a low libido right now?
Dr. Alex:
The short answer is their brain does not believe that that is a priority right now. But yes, we do have an episode. If you’re being chased by a Tiger then you're not gonna need to have sex? Well, not only that, it gets even more complicated to the point like if the hormone is a little bit of a loop, right? If you don't have the hormones, you don't have the inputs to do that. Plus, the disconnect that people have in their bodies. I mean, if you don't love getting naked with someone vulnerable with that you can't even sit with your own emotions. Like there's, there's lots of disconnects there. So, libido is such a complex topic, actually, that that's one of the more comprehensive things is kind of like fertility, in that because it's a thriving mechanism you need to have resolved the reason that you have symptoms and the only reason that you have symptoms is that your body is communicating to you that there are underlying imbalances. So, feeling good and not feeling bad, have the same pathway. So, you overshoot you have to get through the symptoms and then some to get to the really good stuff, then.
Katelyn:
Mm hmm. Calories then in calories out. Why is it outdated? Why is it just like a bunch of bullshit right now?
Dr. Alex:
Oh, boy, I have a lot to say on this one. I think the best way to explain it is the analogy of you would not expect it, you can put the same gas into any car, but your experience driving, you know, a Tesla and what I have now, which is one swift kick away from not being a car anymore, is going to be drastically different. Right? There's just assumes that we are all machines responding to inputs and with the exact same outputs. And you look around and that's clearly not the case. So, if that were to work you would not see why we do have so many products and programs for weight loss if that stuff is just that clear. It doesn't even make sense. So those people harping on it, you know, like you know I'm sure everyone wants to make income but that is essentially like such a simplistic view of the actual when it comes to physiology, which I could nerd on a lot about, but essentially, is the context inside the body that will change what the outputs are. So, without paying attention to the context of what are your hormones doing? How safe does your brain feel? What are your beliefs, unless you change those, then you can't expect a predictable outcome? That's why something that worked for you two years ago, and now you're doing the same thing and not losing weight? Well, that's why.
Katelyn:
Yeah, totally. Cycle Syncing, in like a really brief summary. What is it? Why is it so important?
Dr. Alex:
So that's the subject of context. So, your body has things that it is working on, and optimizing at any given time. And so, it's flowing through a predictable cascade of things that it does, when, because we live in a largely patriarchal society where we are taught like, it's Monday through Friday, you start at 8am, you finish at five, don't take any of that into account. So, the same thing, you work out the same every day, or during, you know, same time each week, you eat the same kind of foods week to week, right. But what that doesn't account for is that there are things that the physiology is guiding, and even changes to the brain the way that it wires and fires over the course of the month. And that is why people will say, you know, that diet worked. Megan has a really great story, you can find that on her podcast, but essentially, she was doing keto with her husband, as a support. And she did it, she started at one part of her cycle, did phenomenal on it, came back to it a couple months later to do something else with him and just was like, I can't even get there. Like I can't even make myself do what I was doing. Right. So, it is completely determined. And then what most people do is they add on guilt and shame. And they're like, there's something wrong with me. But if you actually can understand what your body is doing, and you can flow with it, and just say, I'm not going to do that. Now let's just wait a week and then do it. Like we literally schedule our business things. If there's something really important, we pick the best time that our brain and our body is geared for that kind of thing, then it just feels a lot easier, you know, you're not guessing out why you do certain things or why it turns out that way, you actually understand like, I'm flying with the river, not trying to paddle against it. So that's why it's so important as a basis to everything.
Katelyn:
So, I'll share how I use this in my life, you can tell me if I'm way off or if this is actually right. But I look at my cycle as four seasons. So, the week after my menstrual cycle that's spring. So that's usually when I'm feeling more energized. And that's when I like to schedule more creative projects and things like that. The second week is summer. So, like peak energy, creativity kind of flows to that. And then the third week is fall, so more grounding. And this really goes into foods I'm eating and movement and all of that. And then the week of my cycle is winter. So that's really not scheduling a lot socially and from a work perspective and really just kind of going inwards and giving myself that deep rest and nourishment. Am I on or off with it?
Dr. Alex:
You're pretty, I mean, first of all, for our discussion. Um, if it's right to you, then it's right to you, right. So that's the kind of thing that we're all when people come in, they're like, Well, I do it this way, manga, nice responses, like cool as long as it's working for you. Right? And so, where we tend to not be dogmatic about anything. So that is, I think, just another opportunity where like, in real time, we can say stuff like that, like, yes, you're interviewing us as experts on this kind of thing. And there's still a time and a place where you can be like, we can say the general outline, and people are still individualized. And that is going to be what works for them. So that is that however, yeah, generally we go we think about it in a slightly different way. That's, I mean, our podcast is called four phase cycle podcasts, because there really are four distinct, like, everyone's looking at the same physiology and kind of all of us have come to a similar conclusion that it breaks down in four chunks. We break it down a little bit differently, because our phase one is during this cycle, when you're actually having your period because even though it feels like there's not as much going on that is when your brain is setting up that cycle. So, it's a little bit different in terms of how we think about physiology. But yes, that's essentially it. There's, it's all well balanced, there's two more introspective inwardly down, you know, downregulated times. And then there's the kind of explosive, getting things done being outwardly focused, being active, that kind of thing that is cycled, and then even people who don't have their own native cycle, we have them follow the moon. And it's amazing how often people will start cycling with the moon. And we actually have podcast episodes on that, because that, that gets even more kind of ancestrally. interesting in terms of how we've evolved with all of these systems. But yes, that is essentially how we do things. And so, when the, for example, when we plan things, is the week of our period, that's when the two halves of the brain that hemispheres are communicating the most efficiently and bringing things out of our stored memories and our previous decisions and experiences. And so that's when Megan I plan and compile things and make the decisions on what are the high leverage points. And then once we have that determination, when it comes to the phases that are more like active and actually carrying out the actions, then they're always guided with the knowledge that we garnered from what's important. And so, our to do list or not, what are all the things that I can think of that I need to do? It's what are the high leverage points and from each of those, that's how the to do list gets made.
Katelyn:
So interesting. I love how you're explaining this. It's really resonating with me, and I can't wait to listen to your podcast more. I’m a big advocate of working with your body and not against it. And sounds like you both fully aligned with that as well, too. And, yes, what you're saying is like constantly bringing it back to individualization and just bio individuality. And I think, with this rapid fire, just a caveat. And it is so important for everybody listening, myself included, to acknowledge that it's not a one size fits all, everybody is different. But this is really helpful for just a very generalization of some of these.
Dr. Alex:
There are tricky things that go on, for example, a lot of people say, Oh, you should feel good around ovulation. But if the high estrogen around that time is kicking off your histamine from your mast cells, then a lot of times people feel anxiety and not so good, right? So, if there can be things that either individually vary, because that's how you are, or you can actually individually vary because of what you have going on, which is, you know, why understanding your body and being like, Well, does this actually make sense? Like, is this my true normal? What most of us have an inkling when it's not our normal that there's something a little off?
Katelyn:
Yeah, I love that you're saying that. And just personally speaking, something like this just happened to me. Last month, it was the week of my cycle. And I you know, typically speaking, if I'm getting curious about my emotions, and just my mental state and energy during the month, I really am
just super grounded during that week and really quiet and I want to be, and for some reason, I just had a massive burst of energy when I was actually on my cycle. And it was weird, because it's not something that normally happens, but that also just goes like that proves what you're saying. Like it's not one size fits all, every single month, there's so many other variables and factors that go into play. And that's really important to keep in mind too, because I think that's a slippery slope towards shooting ourselves and the judgment and the comparison and how we should be feeling or what we should be doing versus just how we actually are and giving ourselves the space and the permission to just get curious rather than judgmental.
Dr. Alex:
Well and I think as you go along, like when you kind of understand your body, there's always more layers to it because something that might it's like a fun game we play like, Am I experiencing because like this is my cycle because of what's happening or is it like the moon is the energy like Who are we around? This is what's going on in the world. And role roll Mr. GM things really quick, right? There's just so many things and it's nice to be able to essentially Say, I am an interactive being with my environment, when am I going to make that mean? point. And if it's a moon, you need to have a good cry, then you do that. But you know, again, I think to get there, it has to do that step seven. We talked about this all the time, because sometimes, Megan and I did need to do some of the food, things like where we actually ate good food, and get everybody to get to the point. And then we got to the next step, right. And sometimes, for me, I was the authorized user, were to say, I'm actually going to do some of that. And now I have to focus on food less, Mm hmm. And I make it not as big of a deal. And so, it really morphs over time into whatever it is you're ready for. You'll know it. And that launches you to the next space. And a lot of times I think we make determinations because I'm not there yet. There's something wrong. And we, it's, it's definitely a practice because you just have to continually be like, Wherever I am, is where I need to be.
Katelyn:
Yep, I love that concept. And that word, it's a practice. And it's just taking the next step. And just looking at things curiously and practicing and building skills with ourselves. Okay, a couple more questions. And then we'll wrap it up. Favorite stress reduction techniques, personally, either of you, or ones that you feel like your community just really thrives on that you can offer to ours.
Megan:
Mine is legs up the wall. So just lying with your butt in your legs all the way up the wall, super calming, great getting parasympathetic. And then any form of deep breathing, really, but everyone likes a different form of the deep breathing practices that are so helpful for us personally, and all the ladies we work with. We have a kind of a 12-week system for a parasympathetic nervous essentially getting out of fight or flight and into the rest, digest and heal space. So, there's a ton there. I mean, it can be from having sun on your face to gentle movement to tapping to we have a couple like guasha highlights actually using physical tools.
Dr. Alex:
The things that stimulate the vagus nerve, like humming, singing, gargling, like there's actually a ton of them that we have built in systems in our body that can upregulate up or down. And so you're essentially like learning the buttons to press. Right. So, there's, it's built into our system to do it that way. And then for me, my favorite is probably meditation. Yeah, quieting the mind enough that my internal sense can kick in, because my internal sense will always lead me to the next, like, emotion or impulse that will get me into the right place, even if it's like, I'll maybe run to the store now. And then I run to the store, and I'm like, Oh, yeah, I needed this. And then I got that. And then that caused me to call a person, right? It just doesn't feel that sexy. But ultimately, once you're on that page, and you're following the impulses, then you essentially can't be led astray.
Katelyn:
Yeah, you know, what's interesting about stress reduction is these are generally really simple, gentle practices. And I had a lot of resistance around my own stress reduction practice at first, and I think a lot of a lot of people do because we kind of look at this, like, it's not gonna work, if it's that simple. You know, like putting your legs up the wall, like, is that really gonna do anything? And the truth of the matter is, I think that that's the challenge and a lot of what we're talking about in this conversation, it's to let it be easy, like give yourself permission to let it be easy and just see what happens for yourself.
Megan:
I definitely think that's true. From the belief standpoint. I will also say I think what feeds into it is lack of education, because really, the kind of thing that that we explain in more detail when we have the time but it you know, putting your legs up the wall, it will me like we actually do the this is in the hospital for or I have liked the ICU setting. But essentially it will when you raise your legs, it can put more blood into your bloodstream. As you do that. It's the equivalent of like as if you got an IV and you got some fluid that it has a built-in reflex when the heart fills up with Marbella it lowers the heart rate, so then you're actually causing a drop in your own heart rate and doing that, that gives feedback to the vagus nerve, which is mediating a huge component of the parasympathetic nervous system in terms of transition from brain out to the body. So, with that, you know, when you know why it works the way that it does, it's actually more motivating a lot of times for people because they're like, this isn't some like voodoo magic is having like hypnosis to send rewiring, the brain isn't picking thoughts you like because you want to live in a fantasy land. But if you actually know how neurons hardwire together, based on the inputs you give them, then like, it's a lot more motivating. Because Yeah, this isn't like a shot in the dark. This is just how the body works. Totally. And yeah, the two together is kind of nice, because you need to know how the body works. No, you don't actually because it'll just do it on its own. But does it help with the motivation? And the follow through? We certainly noticed that.
Katelyn:
Mm hmm. No, I love that you brought that up. I think that is super important. And it's a process of the education component, like you're saying, and then just really getting past the stigma and stereotypes around a lot of these things as well, too. And the beliefs like you said before, but I think education is huge. I'm so glad that you brought that up. You both are amazing. I want to talk to you for like two more hours. But it was already super long. You'll have to come back on because I know, there's so much to say. I'm so glad that we got a chance to just jam on all of this really important information and also hear your own body stories. This is really so powerful. So important for this, this community, but also the world. And I just really appreciative. For everybody listening, be sure to check out their podcast too. It sounds like a goldmine of information. And where can everybody find you beyond that? We'll link everything in the show notes. But what's the easiest way for somebody to get connected with you?
Megan:
We would love to have you come on over to @zesty_ginger on Instagram. So, that’s our most interactive platform. And for those of you who want to dig in and really understand the cycles and what Dr. Alex was sharing, she broke it down into 24 Mini pod classes. So, four phase cycle podcasts, go back to season one, episode one. And then we have some exciting ultimate hormone health blueprint training coming up and a healthy hormones group program. So, you can find those all on our Instagram page or zestyginger.com.
Dr. Alex:
I mean, by the time this airs, I'll be wrapping up a 28-day flowing with your cycle. on the podcast so you can catch the tail end of that and catch up all you know the ones that previously so tons and tons of stuff. We're kind of a content machine.
Katelyn:
It sounds like it sounds so valuable, too. Thank you so much, Dr. Alex and Megan, you both are incredible. And I am so grateful for spending this time with you.
Dr. Alex + Megan
Thank you. Thank you for having us. Yeah, this was a pleasure.